14:36 EDT


 

מעקב/פרטי שדות תעופה


-או-


 

קריאות וכותרות ראשיותDude, where's your gear?!

Back to Squawk list

Dude, where's your gear?!

נשלח לפני
 
Notice just how close the crew lowers the gear in relation to the airport. (www.youtube.com) עוד...

Sort type: [Top] [Newest]


JimG4170L
Jim Goldfuss 6
About 10 seconds in, the pitch attitude raises slightly and the flaps appear to lower (possibly beyond 15 degrees). The upward pitch would be in expectation of the nose down moment you would get when the flaps get lowered beyond 15 degrees when drag becomes more prevalent. At that point, the Config warning probably sounded and the PNF probably jumped on the gear. On an ILS, the gear and flaps are hanging out before the OM, on a visual you have more leeway, but flaps/gear are on the landing checklist ("30 degrees, green lights"), and I am reasonably sure the PF didn't call for the landing checklist on short final....someone missed something...glad he didn't stay at flaps 15, he may not have gotten the warning until the GPWS sounded...

[This poster has been suspended.]

sparkie624
sparkie624 1
I was thinking there was a throttle switch, that if they retard the throttles so far back, that it would give a gear warning.... If memory serves. Been along time since I have been on one of those.
sparkie624
sparkie624 3
There are a few reasons this could have happened... 1.) Low on fuel, 2.) Late Check List, 3.) Brain in wrong gear... At least he landed in one piece.
THRUSTT
THRUSTT 3
I read the comments before watching the video, it was close, but not that bad. I thought it happened the second before touchdown.
preacher1
preacher1 2
I'll vote for #3.lol
sparkie624
sparkie624 1
I was trying to be nice.
preacher1
preacher1 1
SootBox
SootBox 2
That'd tie up KORD a good while... fat MD and 5000 FedEx boxes scattered all over the tarmac. The good news is we wouldn't need the black box to know what went wrong.
marinesteban
Esteban Marin 2
You should drop the gear one notch below capturing the glideslope, this flight was executing a visual approach, is customary to drop the gear once on final.
elad731
Adrian C 2
On the lighter side just think how much fuel he saved................
sparkie624
sparkie624 1
Would that not depend on how long the final is :) Maybe so if he is on a 20 mile final, but if he is close final, I would recommend maybe doing it on downwind or base...
THRUSTT
THRUSTT 1
Within a reasonable distance of course. You could intercept the GS 20 miles out if at a higher altitude but wouldn't want to extend the gear then.
sparkie624
sparkie624 1
That much is certain.
onceastudentpilot
tim mitchell 1
yes they would of; it would have taken them three months to reach the same conclusion that we all would have reached on day one...lol
preacher1
preacher1 1
Back in the day, I was taught to call 3 green on base, doing a visual or immediately after turning in on a strait final,sometimes a little earlier depending how you are positioned. Generally a checklist will put you between 5-10 but a lot of it is pilot preference and as I said, it depends on your positioning, BUT, that did appear to be a little too close for comfort.LOL. I have heard of 3 green being called and nobody ever going for the gear. I kinda suspicion that is what happened he as they appeared to come down normally
Derg
Roland Dent 3
If you consider that this was FedEx who prolly have more hours on this machine than anybody else in the galaxy and you consider that this airplane is one of the most difficult to land due to inherent flaws that were overlooked by the FAA then really you should have no reason to quetion this landing. As Sparkie noted there could have been some good reason for this. I have no doubt that the FedEx crews can beat the cheack list at almost any stage of any proceedure.
Derg
Roland Dent 1
I always thought this type had a fuselage mounted midline wheel cart..am I dreaming here? Maybe the DC10 is different?
Moviela
Ric Wernicke 1
The only place you need the wheels down is at the airport. I feel that if you are outside the fence when you get three green, you are good to go. It does not matter how close you are to the fence.
jguillen1225
Jose Guillen 1
This flew in from Memphis, so it would have flown North from KMEM, then swung 90° West to line up with RWY 28. 10 miles out would be over Lake Michigan.
mooman97
Tyler Nichols 1
I thought it was when they were cleared to land they drop the gear.
chalet
chalet 1
You can bet anything that this crew got a lot explaining to do, three greens got to show at least 10 miles out, not ten seconds before TD.
benin
benin 1
talk about a laps in memory. must of been one heck of an approach pattern
sparkie624
sparkie624 4
I wonder if they heard a familiar message: "Too Low Gear! Too Low Gear!"
sparkie624
sparkie624 2
NO... LOL, besides, he should not have been that close to the field before landing being cleared to land.
Talon6969
Talon6969 1
"continue" Happens all the time.
THRUSTT
THRUSTT 1
Ten miles out is too far
preacher1
preacher1 1
Fedex modified all their DC 10's. They are now unofficially MD 10's, pretty much upgraded to MD 11's
Derg
Roland Dent 1
Do you fly this type Chalet?
Klemons
Klemons 1
The MD-10-10F (DC-10-10) has no center gear.
The MD-10-30F (DC-10-30) has a center gear.
flyboy97222
Jason Rhew 1
Where does it say you must be 10 miles out? I drop the gear 3-4 miles out all the time.
SootBox
SootBox 1
Ten miles out is almost Wisconsin...
chalet
chalet 1
Blindfolded any day
preacher1
preacher1 1
I'm much in agreement on the 10 miles but methinks this was a tad short. I'm thinkin' a case of head up the hiney.lol
sparkie624
sparkie624 1
It is easy to tell the difference. the MD-10's do not have the center peg leg gear, and do not have winglets, and also they have been upgraded avionics and converted to 2 man flight crews (Eliminated the Engineer). The MD 11's can carry A LOT more weight as well. If you ever see on with Wing lets and but no Center Gear then that is because it is deferred. You can Defer the center gear up with MAJOR weight restrictions.
chalet
chalet 1
When approaching airports high up in the Andes such as SKRG, SKBO, SEGU, SLPB and others flaps and gear are dropped even 20 miles out as high rates of descend/steep approaches are the norm and the attendant drag helps. A friend of mine a full ATP 777 Captain for Qatar Airways sometimes drops gear and flaps 10 out when flying into European airports.
preacher1
preacher1 2
Ain't this your post from yesterday that is posted down here below?

chalet about a day

quick, quick, what is the HR phone and E-mail, thanks!!! (think would they consider 120 hours on a C-152 working towards IFR, LOL!!)
onceastudentpilot
tim mitchell 1
you know he's talking about FSX..lol

chalet
chalet 2
you silly you (LOL!!)
THRUSTT
THRUSTT 1
Those are special circumstances, not normal.
drumaboy590
drumaboy590 1
google image results supports this as well(i'm no expert)

md-10-10 no center gear
md-10-30 center gear
md-11 winglets + center gear, can be deffered
THRUSTT
THRUSTT 1
It looked slightly "iffy," but not too bad. It did look like the gear took its sweet time to come down though, which could have been an issue. I was thinking head up the hiney too in the box office...
Derg
Roland Dent 1
Qatar does not need to check the monthly gas bill...they get the stuff for cents.
preacher1
preacher1 1
I was a think'in that on all the MD-10's that Fedex modified, that they put winglets on them?
pmemrick
Paul Memrick 1
No. Winglets only on the MD-11's.
THRUSTT
THRUSTT 1
See what happens when you think Preacherman... Take it easy on those cells...
preacher1
preacher1 1
I got my CRJ Friday. We drove down early and picked it up. We were in the air by 1130. 18 minutes on a cold airplane til pushback wasn't bad. ATC let us out quick. Must have been a lite day at DFW as DTO is up on the north end of their area. We went out into Western OK around Clinton(KCSM) and played for a couple hours. Never missed a lick on all we put it thru. Hit KFSM about 1530; mx chief said it's mine for a week. Don't even think about flying it. CEO was standing there too and said yes sir. Other than some playing around, I doubt we'll be doing much before the holidays.
THRUSTT
THRUSTT 1
When did you get typed?
preacher1
preacher1 1
I've been typed for 2-3 years now.Got all that down at Eagle in Ft Worth 2-3 years ago. That 's when me and some others were doing all that fill in the last couple of years before everything blew up, ERJ & CRJ's, the whole family. Besides the trips, we got 2 guys on the King Air that I'll be training up on this one over the next couple of years and then I guess it's the porch and sweet teea for good. Actually, it's Coca-Cola this afternoon. lol. To tell you the truth, I was kinda starting to like it a little. When I get this little jag done, I think I'll be ready for it.
sparkie624
sparkie624 1
Some people just can't walk away from the wings... If he had gotten the Kool-Aid instead of the Sweet Tea and Coke he would have stayed on the porch :)
onceastudentpilot
tim mitchell 1
He's not going anywhere....As soon as someone calls he'll be right back 30 angels...lol
preacher1
preacher1 1
This will make it nice, but to tell you the truth, I have kinda enjoyed that back porch this year. I really thought the truckline would give me something to do and make the transition. I didn't count on that sale coming so now I'm back to this. It will all be interesting. I may work myself out of a job pretty quick anyway if them boys learn fast and we are busy enough for them to build some hours. That will be the key.
marinesteban
Esteban Marin 1
I listened the atc and the tower didn't said anything about their config.
lsailing
lamont sailing 1
What is the stall speed on that airplane with the gear up, and flaps set at approach?. And I wonder what the calculated Vref was? Think about it! Could they fly Vref +5 with the gear up and flaps at approach that close to the end of the runway without stalling? Vref is a calculated speed reference for landing based on several factors but assumes gear down and flaps down to landing configuration. Obviously this crew was flying well above Vref in that confirguration, or they would have recieved a stall warning. Since stall speed for gear up ,flaps approach is higher than the Vref speed for landing gear down and flaps down. If one engine failed at that point the airspeed would have deteriated rapidly and the air craft would have stalled. Because the stall recovery precedure would call for max power flaps approach. Now if the Vref is 145 kts. the sink rate is around 750 - 850 fpm .
This is the result of poor crew procedure, deviating from standard procedure,checklist, I have witnessed more than one crew in the simulators set up there aircraft just the one in the video and crash when an engine quits at dangerous airspeeds/configurations close to the end of the runway.These size aircraft need room and professional cockpit management. The crew in the video was at the proper position to call for flaps to land. I myself personaly would not wait that late in the approach to call for flaps to land, but only after the PNF selected landing flaps that the warning came on and then jumped on the gear handle , because I wonder how much time remained before touch down and time to completed gear down. It is good practice if not required procedure to have your aircraft checklist complete and configured, stabilized, a few miles out.
pmemrick
Paul Memrick 1
In VMC the requirement is to be configured by 500 ft. It's possible to have a descent rate close to 1000 ft/min on a visual, so since the gear came down 30 seconds prior to touchdown, you can do the math. Close, yes. but most likely he met the requirements and saved a ton of Jet A.
jkudlick
Jeremy Kudlick 1
O'Hare Tower: "FedEx 309 Heavy, you appear to be in the wrong configuration."
FDX309: "..."

[This poster has been suspended.]

preacher1
preacher1 2
I do too. Personally if you are doing visual and you got ahold of your bird, you don't even need a checklist, other than to call it out for the CVR to cover your butt if you do crash.lol. I do think they were a little close in though; probably head up the hiney. Happens after a boring flight.
THRUSTT
THRUSTT 1
Phil, u answered that for me, just trying to remember which book it was...
cfisher88
Collin Fisher 1
Configured by 1000, stabilized by 500.
sparkie624
sparkie624 1
You Think... LOL....
Derg
Roland Dent 1
If they did the math this machine would not be allowed to fly at all.
THRUSTT
THRUSTT 1
I don't think they have any responsibility for that at a civilian tower. ORD's too busy to look at every airplane.
THRUSTT
THRUSTT 2
That means I've never been configured nor stabilized

[This poster has been suspended.]

chalet
chalet 4
quick, quick, what is the HR phone and E-mail, thanks!!! (think would they consider 120 hours on a C-152 working towards IFR, LOL!!)
onceastudentpilot
tim mitchell 1
THRUSTT
THRUSTT 1
Spirit Airlines will hire you, a $1,000,000 Riddle degree and 250 hours, you'll get FO in a bus. You don't even have to know basics like whether that's weather or Chicago on the radar for deviation purposes!!!
Derg
Roland Dent 0
Not everyone will want that lifestyle.
THRUSTT
THRUSTT 1
It's hard, the majority of my flights are at night, my body still hasn't gotten used to it...